Basket Cases

Need help finding information or parts for that old machine in your shed? Someone in here will know!

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outforfun
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Re: Basket Cases

Postby outforfun » Fri May 11, 2018 10:10 am

Chippy, looking at your old photos from the 1982 Beenleigh showgrounds... Your Italjet and you almost look the same today. The only thing I can see changed is your beard. You're still riding with style on the green machines, mainly the KT but always great to watch mate



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Re: Basket Cases

Postby Bully fanatic » Fri May 11, 2018 10:45 pm

Okay, I know you have all been waiting in suspense for some photos of an :italjet: which has its gearchange on the correct side so here it is. This is only an engine which spends its life sitting on a shelf waiting for someone to fix it up and install it into a frame. That might take a while as the kickstart shaft is rather sad as you can see in the photos and they are unavailable unless you have one made. A big thank you to Greg Harding for getting these photos down to a size I could use on here.
Italjet Gearshaft. 1..jpg
Italjet Gearshaft. 1..jpg (164.59 KiB) Viewed 3019 times
Italjet Gearshaft. 2..jpg
Italjet Gearshaft. 2..jpg (154.07 KiB) Viewed 3019 times
Italjet Gearshaft. 3..jpg
Italjet Gearshaft. 3..jpg (136.19 KiB) Viewed 3019 times
Italjet Gearshaft. 4..jpg
Italjet Gearshaft. 4..jpg (177.29 KiB) Viewed 3019 times



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Re: Basket Cases

Postby JC1 » Mon May 14, 2018 5:52 pm

Ok Bultaco brains trust, can you ID this head that I found in the shed on the weekend?
Bit of a mystery to me
Have no idea where I got it

Looks like late Sherpa/Alpina outwardly - shape of cut fins etc
CR 9:1
Twin plug-hole obviously
Combustion chamber ID 84mm
Head recessed for top of liner
Attachments
Bul head 3.jpg
Bul head 3.jpg (94.39 KiB) Viewed 2956 times
Bul head 2.jpg
Bul head 2.jpg (92.29 KiB) Viewed 2956 times
Bul head 1.jpg
Bul head 1.jpg (100.32 KiB) Viewed 2956 times


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David Lahey
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Re: Basket Cases

Postby David Lahey » Mon May 14, 2018 7:03 pm

I looked a a few 350 Alpina heads and noticed that the M138 head has the same three plug-hole bosses (fore, central,aft) as the head in your photo. The M138 head has the second hole in the aft position.

The M116 heads had fore, central and LH side bosses (no rear boss) with only the central boss having a hole.

I think that the fin cutaways for the exhaust pipe on your head have been done in a slightly different pattern to the Alpina heads.

After looking at the heads again I just edited this

I'll post a photo of a M116 head soon


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Re: Basket Cases

Postby David Lahey » Mon May 14, 2018 9:33 pm

OK here are photos of what I think is a M116 350 Alpina head
Attachments
IMAG5693.jpg
IMAG5693.jpg (860.96 KiB) Viewed 2934 times
IMAG5694.jpg
IMAG5694.jpg (877.36 KiB) Viewed 2934 times


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Re: Basket Cases

Postby Bully fanatic » Mon May 14, 2018 9:40 pm

It could also be a MK 9 or a MK 10 Matador head which has had a compression release installed. The MK 10s were a Spanish military machine but a few may have found their way over here. They both looked almost the same as an Alpina of that era. Maybe either a Sherpa T or an Alpina which had a compression release on it. The late Sherpas didn`t have those other flat spots in the middle of the head though. So my guess is a late Matador. Graham.



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Re: Basket Cases

Postby David Lahey » Tue May 15, 2018 7:59 pm

Graham Bully Fanatic's post had me thinking because all eight head stud positions are in use on JC's head wheras my Alpina heads only use six of the eight stud locations and I wondered if there was a connection between being a late model 350 (Matador/Alpina) and having all eight holes in use. Thinking that the eight hole thing might be because a gasket needs eight studs to seal when a liner-to-head seal only needs six studs to seal, so maybe when they went to using gaskets in 1977 or so, the 350 Alpina and 350 Matador went to eight holes. Checking the In Motion website photos, the only 84mm head gaskets shown (called 350, 360, 370) would not fit into the recess in JC's head
Still thinking
Maybe JC's head could be from a single-plug 360 Pursang and someone has trimmed the RH side fins and fitted it with a decompressor and used a 360 Pursang/Frontera cylinder to make for a more-speedy 350 Alpina


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Re: Basket Cases

Postby Bully fanatic » Tue May 15, 2018 10:13 pm

David, I don`t think there was a single plug 360 Pursang made. Even the El Banditos are a twin plug head and they were out before the Pursangs. I`m not sure about the very early 350 El Banditos though. The M17. Maybe a El Montadero as they had a kind of up pipe on them. The first 350 Pursangs were the MK 5 350s, M87. I do think that the Montadero heads were different from the normal heads though. :?



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Re: Basket Cases

Postby Bully fanatic » Tue May 15, 2018 10:15 pm

The M213 Alpina had a eight head holes in them with a 83.2mm bore and a 64mm stroke. I can`t remember if the one I had in the late 70`s had a head gasket or not though.



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Re: Basket Cases

Postby JC1 » Thu May 17, 2018 7:02 pm

Dave, if it's any help ID-ing yr Alpina head here is a 138 head.

Bul Alpina M138 head.jpg
Bul Alpina M138 head.jpg (81.41 KiB) Viewed 2687 times

Bul Alpina M138 head  3.jpg
Bul Alpina M138 head 3.jpg (94.5 KiB) Viewed 2687 times

Bul Alpina M138 head  2.jpg
Bul Alpina M138 head 2.jpg (94.03 KiB) Viewed 2687 times

At least it was on a 138 engine, atop a cylinder stamped 116. Fin-cut is a little diff to yours. These heads have narrower stud spacing than my mystery head which has same (wider) stud spacing as all the big-bore Pursangs & Fronteras from M136/M143

Graham, according to a manual I found at custgp.com the 213 Alpina used head gasket like the 199 sherpas.
I did wonder if the mystery head might be Mk10/11 Matador too, but there were so few of them imported & there's very little info on them. They're listed as 8.5:1 CR. More than likely they had the same head as the Alpinas.

Something I've learnt along the way is that big-bore Sherpas had 9:1 CR whereas big-bore Alpinas CR was reduced to 8.5:1 and big-bore Pursangs/Astros ranged 10:1 - 11:1

So I'm inclined to think it's a Sherpa head with the extra lug drilled & tapped for 2nd plug. But which sherpa?

Does anyone know about the 350 sherpa heads after 151 & before 199?

Brownie got any ideas?


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